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and it hits me oh my gosh this is that

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triangle you know there's explanation

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for everything that occurred in the

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rendlesham forest incident did something

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Bob aliens at all it was completely

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silent it comes right over our heads

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it's so classic flying-saucer really

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standing in the clearing he turned over

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to my father held his hand and he looked

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welcome to Podcast UFO for our live show

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we're live every wednesday at eight pm

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eastern standard time on podcast UFO

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calm during the show feel free to

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participate live in our chat room and

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don't forget to Like us on our very

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active Facebook page hello and welcome

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to our live show this is Martin Willis a

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podcast UFO we have a good one for you

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tonight we have guests Ruben Uriarte and

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noe Torres will be coming up a little

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while before that we have alejandro

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rojas with the UFO news i want to thank

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all of you listeners who support the

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show and if you can't support the show

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that's okay we still appreciate each and

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every one of you if you want to listen

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for free you can always listen on

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wednesday evenings at eight to ten p.m.

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eastern standard time right here at

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podcast UFO calm where you can also jump

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in our chat room and we also run the

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full shows as a podcast on the Dark

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Matter digital network on thursdays at

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10 to midnight eastern standard time you

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know i always forget to mention that

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anyone can comment on any podcast you

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have to go in to where the free podcasts

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are for some reason the membership

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podcast won't let you comment there but

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on the free podcast you can leave a

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comment about the guests we have on and

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i was reminded of that because our last

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week's show had some comments come in

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before we get to the news i want to

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remind everyone that i am shaving my

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head bald one week from tonight and this

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is to benefit kids for cancer along with

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their families and we've had some

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listeners sign up and i really

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appreciate it and I'm about halfway to

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my thousand-dollar

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with sponsors and you can sign up now or

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anytime before the event on the

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thirteenth and that's you'll see the one

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mission buzz off banner right on my

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website podcast UFO calm right on the

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side and any amount you want to donate

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is greatly appreciated and Alejandro

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we're going to get started here but I

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got something to tell you it's pretty

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interesting how you doing alejandro I'm

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doing well and I like interesting stuff

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so dad that sounds good yeah well just

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about an hour ago I got an email from a

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listener that I know from the past he's

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been very supportive of the show and he

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said I could use his name his name is

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Alan Sanderson and he was poking around

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on my website today and he saw that I'm

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doing this buzz off on the thirteenth

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and he also saw that i mentioned it was

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my son's birthday so it's kind of

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honoring him and kids in general so he

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wrote me a real nice email he says guess

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what it's my birthday too and if you

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come up short on that one thousand

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dollar goal I will put in the difference

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hi mom and if you hit that goal or

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exceed it I will still donate he says

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this is that sorry and then really may

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God help with that old humanity thing

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for sure it was really nice yeah Thank

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You Man grandma Helen you know that's

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really nice so I'm hoping that our

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guests tonight will be noe Torres I'll

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be I'll be reaching out to him right

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after the news again his skype crash you

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just text me that it's okay and later on

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we're going to be joined by no one other

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than Ruben Uriarte and we're going to

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get into talking about Aurora and a

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couple of other things and the second

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part of the show we're going to be

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talking about something that I have a

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fascination in in the reason why I

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contacted the two of the first place and

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that's the cisco Grove encounter

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alejandro have you ever looked into that

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one well I've interviewed the guys about

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it I guess you have that isn't that a

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fascinating case that nobody really

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seems to talk much about

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yeah well it's weird is this a weird one

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go yeah yeah fun to talk to the fact

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about what happened yeah excellent so

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what's going on with you how are you

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doing I'm not doing too bad doing good

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give you a baby you saying not a lot is

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going on for UFO news but do you have

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anything for us oh I definitely do yeah

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not a lot but there are some stories in

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fact the UFO UFO news stories today that

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have been out there has been one of our

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stories and it's frustrating because

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then the UK tabloids had been all over

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UFO stories and we've talked about this

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and I kind of even say that were like in

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the era of UK tabloid UFO because

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they're picking up stories and putting

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them all over the place most of them not

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very good stories and their kind of you

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know then these get picked up by some of

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the mainstream media and they're setting

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the pace unfortunately really with the

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media um and that my only beef with them

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that they pick up our stories and then

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they don't give us credit or link back

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at least I thought one of the papers did

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but I don't know you and I talked about

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this before the UK picked it up I think

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I might show on Monday but um this is

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exciting that happened on November 7

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2015 and that one of the interesting

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aspects is that it was a guy who was in

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the military and um it's in West

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Carrollton Ohio it was about 630pm when

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he said he saw two craft he described

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them as looking like spinning gems with

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no sound he said they were spinning in

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unison and appeared to be flying in

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formation now these are two points of

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light so oh I don't know how he would

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determine their flying in formation but

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he you know they move across the sky and

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then they fade out he said that they

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were traveling at an unusual speed but

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they did not make any abnormal maneuvers

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just that they were kind of moving and

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then disappeared so he didn't think that

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they were

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uh any you know like a regular plain and

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they don't look like an airplane he

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lives about 15 minutes from Mike

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Patterson in Ohio and he says he's

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worked there and that he's worked as a

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mechanic for the military for for some

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time I'm the video if you look at the

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video alone um it looks like Chinese

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lanterns I mean they look like two

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flickering lights that fade out which is

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the same thing that Chinese lanterns do

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but them this person said it looked

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different than that so take it for what

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you will I suppose now when was just

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posted i don't remember us talking

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specifically about this no yeah and this

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guy is that he's an aircraft mechanic

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for 30 years so he would know airplanes

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I guess that makes it more interesting

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but we posted this one Roger Marsh the

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director of communications from MUFON

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posted this one on march 31st ya know

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what was that I would like that yeah we

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just I don't think we just talked I

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don't think we talked about because I

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don't remember anything elegant the gems

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they look like gems no that's one I

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don't think I've ever heard yeah so i

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don't know i mean could ate a Chinese

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lantern be described as a gem shape

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possibly i think it probably could but

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it is granted and i think a lot of

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people might argue how was a you know an

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aircraft mechanic and a mistake these

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Chinese lanterns for something more

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unusual and true you know this is

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someone who is educated obviously on an

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aircraft but I kind of have a feeling

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that maybe he did make that mistake but

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you know maybe not look at the video and

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see what you guys think and you know

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give your own response so you probably

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haven't looked at this video then no I

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haven't but I will tell you it really

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short okay I may have mentioned this

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before in a show in the past but I was

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out on let's say july 4th like

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was two years ago and someone lit up and

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put up the Chinese lanterns and I'm I

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understand why people call about those

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things I mean they really do look like

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something fantastic in the sky so yeah I

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mean it really that if I if it wasn't

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July 4th and I didn't see them you know

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released because I saw them when they

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were lighting him and let him up and

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everything if I didn't see that and I

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just was like driving by and I looked

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over and I saw that floating this guy I

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would totally think wow what the heck is

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that you know mm-hmm but it no I agree

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with you they look you know there it's

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like these piercing life in the sky they

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look really cool and you can't tell

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distance um when you're looking at them

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I see them fly over before as well and

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they look really cool but and I've also

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launched them on several occasions on

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one I took some video so i can post it

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online and use it for stories to show

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the difference between you know chinese

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lanterns and whatever alleged UFO video

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or posting but you're right they look

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really cool so this is just an ohio that

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was in ohio right and there is another

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interesting video that was posted we

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posted just yesterday well let's hear um

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yeah this siding with april 15 2015 and

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the last one as well as this one the

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MUFON investigators closed as an unknown

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this one is kind of weird you can't see

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the video at the object for very long

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the guy had a problem looking at it but

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you do see it and Roger wrote this story

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again and he was able to get a couple

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snapshots from the video so you can see

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the object better and the object does

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look uh you know up in the sky its a

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large black cylinder shape so it is

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pretty strange this one however might be

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it might be another ifo in that there

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are something called solar balloons out

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there which is essentially you just fill

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up this long plastic black round bag

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really with air and the Sun heats it

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because it's black and it floats alright

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zone

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and that and this does really look like

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that in fact that when I posted it I

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posted that this could be a solar

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balloon and I put a link to an Amazon

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posting for one of these things we could

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buy one and it looks very similar and I

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guess mark dantonio been replying he

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kept I actually did an analysis on this

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video and that's what I determined it

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probably was a mark dantonio is the

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photo and video analyst for MUFON and he

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says that one of the things you know and

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this is the hard part because even if

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it's not a solar balloon at you can't

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rule that out because it doesn't make

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any movement or does not look unlike one

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you know a solar balloon could create

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this effect and that's what comes

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becomes hard with UFO videos it's just

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like the the two lights that look like

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gems you know a to Chinese lanterns is a

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possibility given the video alone and

270
00:12:15,680 --> 00:12:12,720
maybe you know they are something else

271
00:12:18,920 --> 00:12:15,690
but with the video by itself you can't

272
00:12:20,780 --> 00:12:18,930
make that determination I saw a UFO

273
00:12:22,880 --> 00:12:20,790
video a while ago i'm going to say a

274
00:12:24,500 --> 00:12:22,890
couple years ago that caught my eye

275
00:12:26,270 --> 00:12:24,510
because one of the things that has not

276
00:12:28,970 --> 00:12:26,280
talked about a lot or not a lot of

277
00:12:31,580 --> 00:12:28,980
people seem to talk about them is the

278
00:12:34,640 --> 00:12:31,590
cigar-shaped UFO so i was looking for a

279
00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:34,650
cigar-shaped UFOs one day and I saw one

280
00:12:38,180 --> 00:12:36,450
you know posted on YouTube and I open it

281
00:12:40,430 --> 00:12:38,190
up and right away you know my first

282
00:12:43,340 --> 00:12:40,440
thought is you know it was black and it

283
00:12:45,350 --> 00:12:43,350
was sort of like sausage-shaped and I

284
00:12:46,700 --> 00:12:45,360
thought right away it has to be one of

285
00:12:49,790 --> 00:12:46,710
those solar balloons I mean it just

286
00:12:51,590 --> 00:12:49,800
makes a little sense because now how far

287
00:12:54,620 --> 00:12:51,600
up in the atmosphere to those things go

288
00:12:58,010 --> 00:12:54,630
on their own do you how to make you go

289
00:13:00,020 --> 00:12:58,020
very high yeah and that could be a

290
00:13:04,280 --> 00:13:00,030
problem for a jetliner if it goes high

291
00:13:06,950 --> 00:13:04,290
enough it could you know I've heard of

292
00:13:10,820 --> 00:13:06,960
stories in fact one of the great sources

293
00:13:13,370 --> 00:13:10,830
still in the UK for a you echo official

294
00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:13,380
UFO investigations this organization

295
00:13:19,940 --> 00:13:17,010
that analyzes near misses so this is

296
00:13:22,110 --> 00:13:19,950
when you know two planes become get

297
00:13:24,269 --> 00:13:22,120
closer to each other or

298
00:13:26,670 --> 00:13:24,279
when an object is in the air space and

299
00:13:28,530 --> 00:13:26,680
almost hits a plane you know the

300
00:13:30,769 --> 00:13:28,540
airplanes will report this and they have

301
00:13:32,940 --> 00:13:30,779
an organization that investigates those

302
00:13:35,100 --> 00:13:32,950
sometimes those turn out to be

303
00:13:38,519 --> 00:13:35,110
unidentified and sometimes they're

304
00:13:40,140 --> 00:13:38,529
really interesting stories and we'll

305
00:13:43,650 --> 00:13:40,150
post those you know when they come

306
00:13:47,340 --> 00:13:43,660
across and one of them funny enough was

307
00:13:51,630 --> 00:13:47,350
one of those balloon remote-controlled

308
00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:51,640
sharks right and then that actually you

309
00:13:56,460 --> 00:13:53,770
know gotten loose and so it was high

310
00:13:59,070 --> 00:13:56,470
enough where this plane you know had

311
00:14:00,390 --> 00:13:59,080
flown near it and thought it was going

312
00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:00,400
to hit it I don't know that it would

313
00:14:05,190 --> 00:14:02,890
done much damage or anything but them

314
00:14:06,750 --> 00:14:05,200
they were concerned enough you know

315
00:14:10,350 --> 00:14:06,760
where they put in a report to the

316
00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:10,360
near-miss agency but he has that was a

317
00:14:14,100 --> 00:14:12,490
case where one of these toy balloons

318
00:14:15,870 --> 00:14:14,110
getting out of control you know could

319
00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:15,880
have crossed a problem i don't know if

320
00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:17,290
that mighta kinds of problem if it gets

321
00:14:21,570 --> 00:14:19,210
caught in the jet you know or something

322
00:14:23,900 --> 00:14:21,580
can you imagine being in the cockpit of

323
00:14:26,579 --> 00:14:23,910
a passenger airplane with all those

324
00:14:29,340 --> 00:14:26,589
people they're responsible for and

325
00:14:32,490 --> 00:14:29,350
seeing a shark yeah it's like one of

326
00:14:35,070 --> 00:14:32,500
those movies what does it shark tornado

327
00:14:37,410 --> 00:14:35,080
and so like another song attract NATO or

328
00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:37,420
every NATO or I'm looking out of the

329
00:14:42,390 --> 00:14:40,930
window and yelling shark shark and as

330
00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:42,400
you hear the music and address not like

331
00:14:46,260 --> 00:14:44,170
you can run out of the water so what

332
00:14:48,300 --> 00:14:46,270
would people do you probably did run in

333
00:14:52,769 --> 00:14:48,310
circles and jump up and down and back

334
00:14:54,269 --> 00:14:52,779
yeah I like I'm a movie airplane that

335
00:15:01,500 --> 00:14:54,279
should have been part of that movie is

336
00:15:06,930 --> 00:15:01,510
there anything else going on I don't

337
00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:06,940
think so all right well it's always that

338
00:15:11,340 --> 00:15:08,890
way at all yeah good it's it's still

339
00:15:13,350 --> 00:15:11,350
interesting stuff i mean videos and you

340
00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:13,360
know it's great that Rogers able to look

341
00:15:18,510 --> 00:15:15,850
into the files and pull this stuff out

342
00:15:20,670 --> 00:15:18,520
and you know what's helpful it's

343
00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:20,680
learning to for the UFO the MUFON

344
00:15:25,949 --> 00:15:23,290
investigator so I certainly important

345
00:15:27,300 --> 00:15:25,959
people to comment and let people know if

346
00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:27,310
you think I'm full of if you're like

347
00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:30,450
what's all go go club these are UFOs or

348
00:15:34,110 --> 00:15:33,250
aliens and you may be right at world I

349
00:15:37,380 --> 00:15:34,120
know

350
00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:37,390
I love your imitations I every time you

351
00:15:41,970 --> 00:15:39,610
do an imitation a good one I get the

352
00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:41,980
email your best one that people still

353
00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:44,650
can't believe it was you was when you

354
00:15:52,140 --> 00:15:48,490
did Arnold saying go ahead to the Arnold

355
00:15:55,650 --> 00:15:52,150
just throw it out there who's your lid

356
00:16:00,750 --> 00:15:55,660
on absorption daga well yeah get to the

357
00:16:02,430 --> 00:16:00,760
chopper you got some odds I know I do it

358
00:16:04,890 --> 00:16:02,440
who's your daddy huh yeah who's your

359
00:16:07,050 --> 00:16:04,900
daddy and what does he do that was it

360
00:16:09,540 --> 00:16:07,060
yeah perfect all right man well you have

361
00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:09,550
a great week and we'll be talking to

362
00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:12,970
just next week all right yeah talk to

363
00:16:17,519 --> 00:16:14,650
you and better all right have a good one

364
00:16:20,130 --> 00:16:17,529
Oh town belly and Reuben hike on me

365
00:16:22,290 --> 00:16:20,140
there my good buddy I certainly will so

366
00:16:24,150 --> 00:16:22,300
our guests coming up first of all we

367
00:16:27,329 --> 00:16:24,160
have noe Torres will be coming up in

368
00:16:30,180 --> 00:16:27,339
just a minute and along later on Ruben

369
00:16:31,829 --> 00:16:30,190
Uriarte will be joining us and they have

370
00:16:35,430 --> 00:16:31,839
written a number of books about famous

371
00:16:36,450 --> 00:16:35,440
UFO cases including aliens in the forest

372
00:16:40,410 --> 00:16:36,460
we're going to be talking about that in

373
00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:40,420
the second hour and the Khayyam incident

374
00:16:47,340 --> 00:16:43,690
fallen angel UFOs over Mexico Mexico's

375
00:16:49,350 --> 00:16:47,350
Roswell and the real cowboys in aliens I

376
00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:49,360
love that well they've appeared

377
00:16:54,390 --> 00:16:51,490
separately and together on a number of

378
00:16:56,640 --> 00:16:54,400
many television shows including UFO

379
00:17:00,180 --> 00:16:56,650
hunters UFO FILES Monster Hunters

380
00:17:04,169 --> 00:17:00,190
ancient aliens mysteries in the national

381
00:17:07,380 --> 00:17:04,179
parks and UFOs over Earth the research

382
00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:07,390
is featured in an upcoming film by

383
00:17:12,809 --> 00:17:11,050
Patrick Connelly titled they rode the

384
00:17:16,079 --> 00:17:12,819
flying saucers they also appear

385
00:17:18,689 --> 00:17:16,089
frequently on other radio shows and

386
00:17:22,710 --> 00:17:18,699
speak at numerous UFO conference since

387
00:17:25,169 --> 00:17:22,720
each year you're at a is the director of

388
00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:25,179
the mutual UFO network in Northern

389
00:17:32,220 --> 00:17:29,050
California and Tory's is a former MUFON

390
00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:32,230
and state section director from Texas

391
00:17:36,900 --> 00:17:34,450
he's right on the border of Texas he

392
00:17:40,230 --> 00:17:36,910
said it's hot as heck there today all

393
00:17:42,419 --> 00:17:40,240
right so hang in right after this music

394
00:19:27,700 --> 00:17:42,429
break and we'll be right back with the

395
00:19:35,630 --> 00:19:33,230
noe Torres how are you all right

396
00:19:37,520 --> 00:19:35,640
technical problems aside I'm here Martin

397
00:19:39,890 --> 00:19:37,530
thanks for having me on tonight yeah

398
00:19:42,530 --> 00:19:39,900
yeah we had to your skype crashing

399
00:19:44,750 --> 00:19:42,540
burned right just as we were starting to

400
00:19:46,940 --> 00:19:44,760
show so hopefully you got that figured

401
00:19:48,980 --> 00:19:46,950
out it won't happen again well as near

402
00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:48,990
as I can figure it was updating itself

403
00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:50,850
in the background and I didn't realize

404
00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:53,250
it so you know how those things go well

405
00:19:56,540 --> 00:19:54,450
I'll tell you you're not the first

406
00:19:58,300 --> 00:19:56,550
person that this has happened to this is

407
00:20:00,650 --> 00:19:58,310
uh I've heard other people talk about

408
00:20:03,380 --> 00:20:00,660
skype updating while they were doing

409
00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:03,390
something like this so that's what it

410
00:20:08,030 --> 00:20:05,850
was the culprit that the problem is i

411
00:20:11,900 --> 00:20:08,040
use it infrequently on this particular

412
00:20:13,670 --> 00:20:11,910
pc and so every time i attempt to use it

413
00:20:16,820 --> 00:20:13,680
it starts to update itself so that

414
00:20:19,400 --> 00:20:16,830
apparently was a cause of my pride you

415
00:20:22,850 --> 00:20:19,410
need to start it a day ahead anyway

416
00:20:24,830 --> 00:20:22,860
welcome to the show and and ruben will

417
00:20:26,560 --> 00:20:24,840
be joining us later on he's just going

418
00:20:29,060 --> 00:20:26,570
to skype in and we'll connect with him

419
00:20:32,510 --> 00:20:29,070
it's always good to have you two on your

420
00:20:36,740 --> 00:20:32,520
on before I talked to ruben when he was

421
00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:36,750
visiting alejandro a while back down in

422
00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:40,290
Arizona anyway you have some exciting

423
00:20:45,560 --> 00:20:42,810
things to talk about first of all for

424
00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:45,570
the person that has never heard both

425
00:20:50,270 --> 00:20:47,970
either you or ruben in the past why

426
00:20:52,430 --> 00:20:50,280
don't you give your background and it's

427
00:20:55,460 --> 00:20:52,440
always interesting to hear everybody's

428
00:21:00,110 --> 00:20:55,470
story when they first fell in love with

429
00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:00,120
UFOs so let's hear it well I grew up in

430
00:21:07,640 --> 00:21:03,570
the 60s and as far as as far back as I

431
00:21:09,620 --> 00:21:07,650
can remember as a child my mom used to

432
00:21:13,100 --> 00:21:09,630
tell me a story about a very strange

433
00:21:14,870 --> 00:21:13,110
encounter she had one evening before I

434
00:21:18,950 --> 00:21:14,880
was born this would have been in the

435
00:21:21,170 --> 00:21:18,960
1940s here in South Texas I live along

436
00:21:24,770 --> 00:21:21,180
the border between Texas and Mexico in

437
00:21:26,690 --> 00:21:24,780
the area of McAllen Texas and she used

438
00:21:30,290 --> 00:21:26,700
to tell me this story about an encounter

439
00:21:33,139 --> 00:21:30,300
she had in the woods behind our home we

440
00:21:37,129 --> 00:21:33,149
lived in a rural area far removed from

441
00:21:38,899 --> 00:21:37,139
other other homes and it was kind of it

442
00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:38,909
was very dark at night we weren't in a

443
00:21:46,070 --> 00:21:44,129
city and so one night she heard a lot of

444
00:21:48,219 --> 00:21:46,080
commotion behind the house and she

445
00:21:51,469 --> 00:21:48,229
wandered out the middle of the night

446
00:21:53,570 --> 00:21:51,479
sometime after midnight and she used to

447
00:21:56,149 --> 00:21:53,580
tell me this incredible story of a

448
00:21:59,869 --> 00:21:56,159
strange object that was above her and

449
00:22:03,009 --> 00:21:59,879
she heard the noise and she heard

450
00:22:05,930 --> 00:22:03,019
strange noises above her and lights and

451
00:22:10,549 --> 00:22:05,940
illuminating the ground and the trees

452
00:22:12,619 --> 00:22:10,559
all around her and her pet dog at that

453
00:22:14,930 --> 00:22:12,629
time which was a large German Shepherd

454
00:22:18,049 --> 00:22:14,940
jumping up into the air and snapping its

455
00:22:21,079 --> 00:22:18,059
jawless at whatever it was a was above

456
00:22:24,739 --> 00:22:21,089
her so as a child when she used to tell

457
00:22:27,169 --> 00:22:24,749
me the story on what what in effect what

458
00:22:29,690 --> 00:22:27,179
happened is I was very much of a reader

459
00:22:33,070 --> 00:22:29,700
and always have been and my love of

460
00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:33,080
books throughout the years has been

461
00:22:38,839 --> 00:22:36,570
quite quite great and so at that time I

462
00:22:43,129 --> 00:22:38,849
sought out every book that I could find

463
00:22:45,139 --> 00:22:43,139
in the mid-60s I was a frequent library

464
00:22:48,739 --> 00:22:45,149
user both of our local public library

465
00:22:52,669 --> 00:22:48,749
and also my school library and I sought

466
00:22:55,430 --> 00:22:52,679
out every book about every UFO case that

467
00:22:58,009 --> 00:22:55,440
I could find and I must have you know I

468
00:22:59,690 --> 00:22:58,019
read hundreds of books way back then as

469
00:23:01,909 --> 00:22:59,700
a kid became very interested in the

470
00:23:04,849 --> 00:23:01,919
topic also the interesting thing about

471
00:23:08,599 --> 00:23:04,859
the 60s as most of your listeners I'm

472
00:23:12,289 --> 00:23:08,609
sure know we were really strongly into

473
00:23:14,719 --> 00:23:12,299
the UFO phenomenon still the 50s had

474
00:23:16,190 --> 00:23:14,729
been the explosion of UFOs and mass UFO

475
00:23:19,579 --> 00:23:16,200
sightings throughout the United States

476
00:23:23,259 --> 00:23:19,589
but it continued to a lesser extent

477
00:23:26,509 --> 00:23:23,269
perhaps but also very much so in the 60s

478
00:23:30,739 --> 00:23:26,519
until you know the end of Project Blue

479
00:23:33,109 --> 00:23:30,749
Book in the in the late 60s and various

480
00:23:35,570 --> 00:23:33,119
other factors on a national scene kind

481
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:35,580
of eroded interest in you oppose for a

482
00:23:41,690 --> 00:23:39,450
while until perhaps Steven Spielberg's

483
00:23:45,860 --> 00:23:41,700
series of movies et Close Encounters

484
00:23:49,610 --> 00:23:45,870
brought it back but but yeah so

485
00:23:52,610 --> 00:23:49,620
the interest in UFOs is something that

486
00:23:58,850 --> 00:23:52,620
has persisted in my life from the

487
00:24:02,570 --> 00:23:58,860
beginning and you know I've read tons of

488
00:24:05,060 --> 00:24:02,580
books on the subject and professionally

489
00:24:06,830 --> 00:24:05,070
I am a librarian I have a master's

490
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:06,840
degree in library science from

491
00:24:12,470 --> 00:24:09,330
university of texas at austin and have

492
00:24:16,310 --> 00:24:12,480
been a librarian for close to 25 years

493
00:24:22,820 --> 00:24:16,320
now and every library that I've worked

494
00:24:25,430 --> 00:24:22,830
in I've made sure has a very large and

495
00:24:28,280 --> 00:24:25,440
healthy collection of books about UFOs

496
00:24:30,169 --> 00:24:28,290
and Lobo sightings so I became

497
00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:30,179
interested in actually writing books

498
00:24:37,850 --> 00:24:33,330
about UFOs a few years back and in

499
00:24:41,210 --> 00:24:37,860
partnership with Ruben Uriarte who will

500
00:24:43,940 --> 00:24:41,220
be on you know a little while later will

501
00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:43,950
be on your show but he and I had a

502
00:24:49,120 --> 00:24:45,570
number of discussions because I was

503
00:24:52,549 --> 00:24:49,130
working on a book about Texas UFO cases

504
00:24:55,700 --> 00:24:52,559
at the time that I first contacted Rubin

505
00:24:58,900 --> 00:24:55,710
and he had done research into an alleged

506
00:25:03,560 --> 00:24:58,910
UFO incident that occurred in West Texas

507
00:25:06,890 --> 00:25:03,570
along the texas-mexico border kind of

508
00:25:08,090 --> 00:25:06,900
north northwest of where I lived and he

509
00:25:10,790 --> 00:25:08,100
was about the only one in the whole

510
00:25:13,010 --> 00:25:10,800
country that I had found reference to I

511
00:25:16,190 --> 00:25:13,020
did some internet searches and some

512
00:25:18,890 --> 00:25:16,200
periodical literature searches and he

513
00:25:20,660 --> 00:25:18,900
was one of the few people that had been

514
00:25:24,290 --> 00:25:20,670
doing anything with that case so i

515
00:25:26,390 --> 00:25:24,300
called them emailed him and i emailed

516
00:25:28,070 --> 00:25:26,400
several other people as well who had

517
00:25:30,770 --> 00:25:28,080
mentioned the case and Ruben was the

518
00:25:35,900 --> 00:25:30,780
only one who responded so that was back

519
00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:35,910
in 2007 and Reuben and I since 2007 have

520
00:25:42,169 --> 00:25:39,290
written 12 books written or co-written

521
00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:42,179
along with other UFO researchers 12

522
00:25:49,549 --> 00:25:46,170
books about famous UFO cases in history

523
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:49,559
so well so that's how it all began for

524
00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:53,010
me and once we we did our first book

525
00:25:59,270 --> 00:25:56,610
together in 2007 Mexico's Roswell which

526
00:26:01,310 --> 00:25:59,280
was which was the case that I

527
00:26:04,610 --> 00:26:01,320
was coincidentally planning to include

528
00:26:05,870 --> 00:26:04,620
as a chapter in my book on well that's

529
00:26:08,270 --> 00:26:05,880
it we're taking a little station break

530
00:26:12,230 --> 00:26:08,280
here because noe skype crashed right

531
00:26:15,890 --> 00:26:12,240
there we had to move on with him on a

532
00:26:17,690 --> 00:26:15,900
landline which up you're lucky to be a

533
00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:17,700
podcast listener actually because the

534
00:26:23,420 --> 00:26:20,730
live listeners had to listen to maybe

535
00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:23,430
five minutes of the fumbling trying to

536
00:26:28,610 --> 00:26:25,290
get this together so no he's coming

537
00:26:30,530 --> 00:26:28,620
right back right here on his phone which

538
00:26:34,570 --> 00:26:30,540
isn't great but it's there they're not

539
00:26:38,210 --> 00:26:34,580
having a show okay is this you knowing

540
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:38,220
yeah this is me I'm sorry i I'm having

541
00:26:44,930 --> 00:26:40,290
all kinds of technical issues obviously

542
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:44,940
and uh yeah but we can continue this way

543
00:26:52,310 --> 00:26:47,490
yeah okay are you on you calling me from

544
00:26:53,780 --> 00:26:52,320
a landline yeah okay so i think the live

545
00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:53,790
listener out there i was just blabbing

546
00:26:58,940 --> 00:26:56,250
here saying absolutely nothing that

547
00:27:01,160 --> 00:26:58,950
makes any sense but i think the listener

548
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:01,170
can still call in on this number and i

549
00:27:04,340 --> 00:27:02,850
can take two calls if you'd like if

550
00:27:06,410 --> 00:27:04,350
someone wants to call in at some point

551
00:27:11,420 --> 00:27:06,420
oh yeah sure that's our problem and

552
00:27:14,330 --> 00:27:11,430
that's numbers 9660 396 7403 oh thank

553
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:14,340
you live listeners for hanging in so

554
00:27:18,110 --> 00:27:16,050
we're back with noe torres and you know

555
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:18,120
what with all this happening i didn't

556
00:27:23,210 --> 00:27:20,850
have my pen and paper handy too right

557
00:27:24,710 --> 00:27:23,220
where we left off and you may have been

558
00:27:26,570 --> 00:27:24,720
talking for another 20 minutes before

559
00:27:29,360 --> 00:27:26,580
you realize it was a problem so I've no

560
00:27:31,730 --> 00:27:29,370
idea unfortunately I did I get to I get

561
00:27:34,820 --> 00:27:31,740
wound up and I get going and I didn't

562
00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:34,830
even look down at my alright so let me

563
00:27:38,750 --> 00:27:36,450
let me just ask you a couple questions

564
00:27:41,150 --> 00:27:38,760
to backtrack a little bit your mother

565
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:41,160
your mother citing you don't hear of a

566
00:27:47,060 --> 00:27:44,010
lot of sightings when someone has they

567
00:27:49,670 --> 00:27:47,070
hear sound you know if my mother was

568
00:27:52,420 --> 00:27:49,680
telling me a story like that I would

569
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:52,430
have paid attention to what was going on

570
00:27:57,770 --> 00:27:56,010
myself you know I believe you left off

571
00:27:58,970 --> 00:27:57,780
where you were talking about being a

572
00:28:03,230 --> 00:27:58,980
librarian to make sure there was a

573
00:28:06,710 --> 00:28:03,240
healthy supply of UFO books wherever you

574
00:28:09,460 --> 00:28:06,720
have worked yeah because because of my

575
00:28:12,950 --> 00:28:09,470
own interest in the topic I've always

576
00:28:15,889 --> 00:28:12,960
I've always you know

577
00:28:18,620 --> 00:28:15,899
had a fully stocked collection of UFO

578
00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:18,630
books and people always come up to me

579
00:28:23,750 --> 00:28:21,570
and asked me about the topic because I

580
00:28:27,169 --> 00:28:23,760
am frequently interviewed by the local

581
00:28:32,180 --> 00:28:27,179
media about the topic of UFOs and I also

582
00:28:34,490 --> 00:28:32,190
appear at various local venues thinking

583
00:28:36,620 --> 00:28:34,500
about it so a lot of folks in this

584
00:28:40,220 --> 00:28:36,630
community are familiar with my interest

585
00:28:42,350 --> 00:28:40,230
in the topic and so I do feel a lot of

586
00:28:45,019 --> 00:28:42,360
questions about it I want to say

587
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:45,029
reference questions but some of them are

588
00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:47,570
a bit more personal than that people

589
00:28:55,130 --> 00:28:50,730
wanting me to hear their own of their

590
00:28:58,760 --> 00:28:55,140
own experiences and it's amazing to me

591
00:29:02,060 --> 00:28:58,770
how many people have had an experience

592
00:29:04,190 --> 00:29:02,070
or knows somebody close to them who have

593
00:29:08,450 --> 00:29:04,200
in almost every area of the country that

594
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:08,460
I travel and they don't feel they don't

595
00:29:13,730 --> 00:29:11,250
feel safe a lot of time sharing it with

596
00:29:15,919 --> 00:29:13,740
somebody who could possibly ridicule

597
00:29:18,470 --> 00:29:15,929
them I don't know how this person will

598
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:18,480
react if they tell them the story no

599
00:29:21,139 --> 00:29:20,010
you're going to have to pardon me you're

600
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:21,149
going to have to get into your phone

601
00:29:27,500 --> 00:29:23,730
more we're good we're barely hearing

602
00:29:29,450 --> 00:29:27,510
yeah so a lot of folks a lot of folks

603
00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:29,460
are hesitant to tell anyone about their

604
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:33,090
experience but but in my case because

605
00:29:38,350 --> 00:29:36,090
I'm I'm appearing as a speaker on the

606
00:29:42,470 --> 00:29:38,360
topic and they feel more comfortable I

607
00:29:46,180 --> 00:29:42,480
see uh-huh you're right I've been in

608
00:29:49,549 --> 00:29:46,190
mixed crowds and you know it comes up

609
00:29:52,010 --> 00:29:49,559
and I'm actually surprised that you're

610
00:29:53,539 --> 00:29:52,020
almost anyone you talk to if you're

611
00:29:56,710 --> 00:29:53,549
comfortable enough to actually bring up

612
00:30:01,180 --> 00:29:56,720
the subject if it's not them then

613
00:30:04,370 --> 00:30:01,190
they're open-minded about it and and

614
00:30:07,130 --> 00:30:04,380
it's happening in my business to more

615
00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:07,140
and more people since if anyone does any

616
00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:08,730
search on the internet with my name

617
00:30:14,930 --> 00:30:11,250
you'll see antiques first and then

618
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:14,940
you'll see UFO seconds so there's a lot

619
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:16,890
of people that in the last few weeks

620
00:30:23,659 --> 00:30:20,970
that have found out that i'm actually in

621
00:30:26,510 --> 00:30:23,669
to this topic i haven't gotten any grief

622
00:30:29,420 --> 00:30:26,520
about it now of speaking of that you

623
00:30:31,520 --> 00:30:29,430
you stock the library full you do all

624
00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:31,530
this art do you get ridiculed at all or

625
00:30:39,020 --> 00:30:35,490
people pretty okay with you in this

626
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:39,030
topic well absolutely no ridicule

627
00:30:50,630 --> 00:30:44,810
whatsoever and and I should say that I

628
00:30:53,570 --> 00:30:50,640
am quite I subject every story I hear

629
00:30:56,120 --> 00:30:53,580
the every UFO story are here as I feel

630
00:31:01,310 --> 00:30:56,130
everybody should to a to a high degree

631
00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:01,320
of skepticism and critical review it's

632
00:31:06,770 --> 00:31:04,290
very important for us to of course in

633
00:31:08,990 --> 00:31:06,780
this field be very very careful about

634
00:31:11,830 --> 00:31:09,000
spreading information that has not been

635
00:31:15,530 --> 00:31:11,840
verified and that possibly it is

636
00:31:19,820 --> 00:31:15,540
entirely inaccurate possibly made up so

637
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:19,830
high tech to I stick close the cases

638
00:31:25,510 --> 00:31:23,610
that have had what I feel is a proper

639
00:31:31,010 --> 00:31:25,520
amount of research done and

640
00:31:35,630 --> 00:31:31,020
documentation and eyewitnesses who have

641
00:31:38,930 --> 00:31:35,640
been found to be credible and telling

642
00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:38,940
their story so we try our very best to

643
00:31:48,890 --> 00:31:44,090
do that so I have never found myself

644
00:31:52,940 --> 00:31:48,900
feeling as though I'm the subject of of

645
00:31:57,590 --> 00:31:52,950
ridicule or anyone saying anything bad

646
00:32:00,350 --> 00:31:57,600
about me and and and like I say but the

647
00:32:02,330 --> 00:32:00,360
amazing thing for me as I I speak a lot

648
00:32:05,570 --> 00:32:02,340
of local venues as I mentioned and

649
00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:05,580
there's usually a line of people waiting

650
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:08,370
to talk to me personally after the talks

651
00:32:13,910 --> 00:32:10,890
because they want to share with me their

652
00:32:15,890 --> 00:32:13,920
own feelings and encounters that they

653
00:32:19,460 --> 00:32:15,900
themselves had or someone in their

654
00:32:22,460 --> 00:32:19,470
family has had and that's been the most

655
00:32:27,050 --> 00:32:22,470
amazing part for me how many of the

656
00:32:30,830 --> 00:32:27,060
people that highly live close to here

657
00:32:34,940 --> 00:32:30,840
and I walk past every day work with and

658
00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:34,950
so forth feel that they have encountered

659
00:32:39,490 --> 00:32:37,650
something along the same lines in their

660
00:32:42,970 --> 00:32:39,500
own life experience so

661
00:32:47,950 --> 00:32:42,980
that's been a strange experience for me

662
00:32:49,330 --> 00:32:47,960
now I have to say this quickly what what

663
00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:49,340
type of phone did you call me back on

664
00:32:57,460 --> 00:32:55,130
this is just a regular house telephone

665
00:33:02,080 --> 00:32:57,470
okay you known and speak Latin I you at

666
00:33:05,460 --> 00:33:02,090
how you know how to speaker phone no

667
00:33:07,510 --> 00:33:05,470
okay i heerd the button like the

668
00:33:09,430 --> 00:33:07,520
numerical button pushed every now and

669
00:33:12,820 --> 00:33:09,440
then so just just be aware of that if

670
00:33:16,810 --> 00:33:12,830
you would so okay fine I'm probably too

671
00:33:19,060 --> 00:33:16,820
close to it trying to you know speak up

672
00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:19,070
closer to the microphone but i'll try to

673
00:33:24,220 --> 00:33:21,170
avoid that yeah okay all right very good

674
00:33:28,210 --> 00:33:24,230
so let's um let's get into some of the

675
00:33:31,330 --> 00:33:28,220
topics that we plan to talk about you

676
00:33:35,020 --> 00:33:31,340
and Reuben and a bunch of other people

677
00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:35,030
are showing showing up coming up I

678
00:33:43,050 --> 00:33:37,610
believe it's next weekend is that right

679
00:33:49,150 --> 00:33:45,550
yeah that's April sixteenth it's a

680
00:33:53,260 --> 00:33:49,160
Saturday and it's a really neat new

681
00:33:56,410 --> 00:33:53,270
thing it's a new event for in UFO

682
00:34:01,630 --> 00:33:56,420
circles that has never never been done

683
00:34:04,210 --> 00:34:01,640
before and it it's sir it's about a UFO

684
00:34:09,659 --> 00:34:04,220
case that's been known for quite some

685
00:34:13,090 --> 00:34:09,669
time it's called the Aurora UFO crash of

686
00:34:15,940 --> 00:34:13,100
1897 which seems like a really long time

687
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:15,950
ago it's kind of during the Wild West

688
00:34:22,300 --> 00:34:19,570
days and it has it has a lot of

689
00:34:24,419 --> 00:34:22,310
interesting appeal to UFO researchers we

690
00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:24,429
could had happened in an arrow before

691
00:34:32,530 --> 00:34:29,570
airplanes existed and before most kinds

692
00:34:35,710 --> 00:34:32,540
of air vehicles exists that there were

693
00:34:38,470 --> 00:34:35,720
some hot air balloons in that general

694
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:38,480
time frame but there wasn't much flying

695
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:43,370
in the sky except birds so 1897 April is

696
00:34:48,970 --> 00:34:45,530
fun this incident occurred in all these

697
00:34:51,790 --> 00:34:48,980
years over a hundred years later the

698
00:34:53,020 --> 00:34:51,800
place where it happened Aurora Texas is

699
00:34:57,190 --> 00:34:53,030
having the first

700
00:35:00,070 --> 00:34:57,200
her official city commemoration of the

701
00:35:03,430 --> 00:35:00,080
event and they've invited a number of

702
00:35:06,610 --> 00:35:03,440
really really top UFO researchers and

703
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:06,620
speakers including Travis Walton and Jim

704
00:35:14,770 --> 00:35:10,970
Marrs nick redfern two to appear in

705
00:35:16,420 --> 00:35:14,780
commemoration of that is that yeah

706
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:16,430
that's that's great so this is the first

707
00:35:23,380 --> 00:35:19,010
time now let's talk about that

708
00:35:28,150 --> 00:35:23,390
particular case this was three years or

709
00:35:31,900 --> 00:35:28,160
so before there were any of the ridge of

710
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:31,910
powered dirigibles right that's correct

711
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:34,570
we had there were some hot air balloons

712
00:35:43,870 --> 00:35:40,090
but the dirigibles that could be steered

713
00:35:48,850 --> 00:35:43,880
that were motor powered were just still

714
00:35:52,780 --> 00:35:48,860
being developed at that time uh uh huh

715
00:35:57,010 --> 00:35:52,790
and can you describe the incident to the

716
00:35:59,230 --> 00:35:57,020
listener please yeah and and before I

717
00:36:05,020 --> 00:35:59,240
launch into that I just want to say that

718
00:36:08,830 --> 00:36:05,030
in 1897 science fiction was virtually

719
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:08,840
unknown hg wells had not published War

720
00:36:18,820 --> 00:36:14,930
of the Worlds you know air airplanes and

721
00:36:25,210 --> 00:36:18,830
space vehicles were not in anyone's

722
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:25,220
vocabulary there would have been in my

723
00:36:28,930 --> 00:36:26,810
way of thinking there would have been

724
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:28,940
very little reason for someone to make

725
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:33,610
totally make up a story about UFOs

726
00:36:39,090 --> 00:36:36,770
crashing on earth and a creature that

727
00:36:43,030 --> 00:36:39,100
did not appear to be from planet earth

728
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:43,040
being found in the wreckage you know it

729
00:36:48,220 --> 00:36:45,890
just to me the stretch of the

730
00:36:51,730 --> 00:36:48,230
imagination to think that somebody would

731
00:36:56,220 --> 00:36:51,740
just out of the blue make something like

732
00:37:02,200 --> 00:36:56,230
that up but the story was that in April

733
00:37:05,230 --> 00:37:02,210
on April seventeenth 1897 three years

734
00:37:06,820 --> 00:37:05,240
before the turn of the century and I

735
00:37:10,510 --> 00:37:06,830
should I should also note

736
00:37:13,990 --> 00:37:10,520
50 years before the reported crash of a

737
00:37:17,620 --> 00:37:14,000
UFO in Roswell New Mexico which happened

738
00:37:21,090 --> 00:37:17,630
in 1947 so this was eighteen ninety

739
00:37:24,670 --> 00:37:21,100
seven fifty years before about 30 miles

740
00:37:29,160 --> 00:37:24,680
from Fort Worth Texas about 30 miles

741
00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:29,170
west west northwest of Fort Worth Texas

742
00:37:36,090 --> 00:37:32,450
the observers in town a number of

743
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:36,100
observers told told the local newspapers

744
00:37:41,110 --> 00:37:38,930
the article later appeared in the Fort

745
00:37:46,570 --> 00:37:41,120
Worth newspaper and in the Dallas

746
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:46,580
Morning News in 1897 so these observers

747
00:37:55,450 --> 00:37:52,010
or witnesses told told the newspapers

748
00:37:59,140 --> 00:37:55,460
that there was a an object that drifted

749
00:38:03,940 --> 00:37:59,150
into town going at a slow rate of speed

750
00:38:08,260 --> 00:38:03,950
it was metallic and appeared to weigh

751
00:38:12,520 --> 00:38:08,270
several tons from its appearance and as

752
00:38:18,220 --> 00:38:12,530
it drifted over the town it came to

753
00:38:20,410 --> 00:38:18,230
collision with a windmill in town and we

754
00:38:22,000 --> 00:38:20,420
don't know whether it was related to the

755
00:38:25,300 --> 00:38:22,010
collision with the end mill over the

756
00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:25,310
windmill or that was just you know the

757
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:28,130
fact that it collided with one mill had

758
00:38:33,520 --> 00:38:29,810
nothing to do with the fact that it

759
00:38:35,860 --> 00:38:33,530
exploded soon afterwards it went to

760
00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:35,870
pieces was the exact language that was

761
00:38:43,150 --> 00:38:38,930
used by one witness right over the

762
00:38:46,060 --> 00:38:43,160
center of the small town which had you

763
00:38:52,300 --> 00:38:46,070
know around two thousand population of

764
00:38:54,310 --> 00:38:52,310
around 2,000 people at that time so when

765
00:38:55,690 --> 00:38:54,320
the townspeople gathered around to see

766
00:38:59,800 --> 00:38:55,700
what had happened they were looking

767
00:39:03,040 --> 00:38:59,810
through this debris it was metallic one

768
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:03,050
of the witnesses described it as sort of

769
00:39:09,460 --> 00:39:05,410
looking like sort of a cross between

770
00:39:11,260 --> 00:39:09,470
aluminum and silver when they were

771
00:39:14,110 --> 00:39:11,270
looking through these pieces of metal

772
00:39:19,300 --> 00:39:14,120
they found in the midst of them a small

773
00:39:20,620 --> 00:39:19,310
humanoid being that one witness said was

774
00:39:25,690 --> 00:39:20,630
clearly not

775
00:39:29,140 --> 00:39:25,700
an inhabitant of this world so what

776
00:39:30,790 --> 00:39:29,150
happened next was people from all the

777
00:39:33,190 --> 00:39:30,800
neighboring towns according to the

778
00:39:38,380 --> 00:39:33,200
newspaper account came to see this

779
00:39:40,300 --> 00:39:38,390
amazing wondrous thing strange object

780
00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:40,310
that it crashed pieces of metal

781
00:39:47,980 --> 00:39:44,650
everywhere over wide area they found

782
00:39:51,430 --> 00:39:47,990
pieces of paper with or what seemed to

783
00:39:53,620 --> 00:39:51,440
be paper with writing on it that one of

784
00:39:58,210 --> 00:39:53,630
the witness described as being similar

785
00:40:02,170 --> 00:39:58,220
in appearance to hieroglyphics it was

786
00:40:04,450 --> 00:40:02,180
not any known language that anybody

787
00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:04,460
could tell all right hang on just a

788
00:40:11,650 --> 00:40:06,770
moment ty for that hang on just a moment

789
00:40:14,050 --> 00:40:11,660
if you would uh Ruben how are you party

790
00:40:17,050 --> 00:40:14,060
hey glad to have you on the show so

791
00:40:18,700 --> 00:40:17,060
Reuben mariotti he actually has his

792
00:40:23,770 --> 00:40:18,710
skype is working knowing how about that

793
00:40:25,420 --> 00:40:23,780
oh that's fantastic yeah we've had some

794
00:40:29,350 --> 00:40:25,430
issues but we're going to move on here

795
00:40:31,620 --> 00:40:29,360
now I will tell you that no II is right

796
00:40:35,980 --> 00:40:31,630
dead center in the middle of telling the

797
00:40:38,770 --> 00:40:35,990
story about the Aurora incident the

798
00:40:40,450 --> 00:40:38,780
crash oh very good very good I'll sit

799
00:40:44,010 --> 00:40:40,460
quietly here all right now I keep

800
00:40:46,390 --> 00:40:44,020
continue if you would so as I mentioned

801
00:40:47,980 --> 00:40:46,400
according to the newspaper accounts from

802
00:40:52,630 --> 00:40:47,990
both the Fort Worth and Dallas

803
00:40:55,330 --> 00:40:52,640
newspapers in April 1897 this object

804
00:40:59,170 --> 00:40:55,340
crashed in the middle of town it hit a

805
00:41:04,030 --> 00:40:59,180
windmill on the way down exploded debris

806
00:41:06,790 --> 00:41:04,040
came raining down a lot of people assume

807
00:41:09,160 --> 00:41:06,800
that the collision was a windmill caused

808
00:41:11,490 --> 00:41:09,170
the crash but that based on the

809
00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:11,500
eyewitness descriptions I would say not

810
00:41:17,620 --> 00:41:14,690
it apparently was already in stress and

811
00:41:20,200 --> 00:41:17,630
it exploded and I think the collision

812
00:41:24,430 --> 00:41:20,210
with a windmill was just coincidental or

813
00:41:27,190 --> 00:41:24,440
incidental but in any event strewn among

814
00:41:29,550 --> 00:41:27,200
the wreckage in the midst of all the

815
00:41:32,950 --> 00:41:29,560
records that was strewn over a wide area

816
00:41:34,030 --> 00:41:32,960
there was found this small humanoid

817
00:41:37,390 --> 00:41:34,040
beings

818
00:41:41,820 --> 00:41:37,400
which was described as not an inhabitant

819
00:41:49,300 --> 00:41:41,830
of this world in the newspaper account

820
00:41:52,180 --> 00:41:49,310
so this uh the people checked the pilots

821
00:41:55,240 --> 00:41:52,190
body and it was on the body of this

822
00:42:00,340 --> 00:41:55,250
pilot that they found papers written in

823
00:42:02,830 --> 00:42:00,350
an unknown language they they thought

824
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:02,840
that this might have been a record of

825
00:42:08,620 --> 00:42:05,930
the journeys the pilots journeys that he

826
00:42:10,330 --> 00:42:08,630
had made but nobody knew how to how to

827
00:42:13,390 --> 00:42:10,340
interpret them and one of the witnesses

828
00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:13,400
that quote they were written in some

829
00:42:22,330 --> 00:42:16,370
unknown hieroglyphics and could not be

830
00:42:24,580 --> 00:42:22,340
understood so the townspeople then there

831
00:42:29,380 --> 00:42:24,590
were many visitors from surrounding town

832
00:42:32,230 --> 00:42:29,390
that showed up wanting to see the object

833
00:42:33,970 --> 00:42:32,240
that it crashed and the being and so

834
00:42:35,740 --> 00:42:33,980
they came from miles around and the

835
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:35,750
newspaper accounts interestingly enough

836
00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:39,290
say that they gathered pieces of the

837
00:42:45,730 --> 00:42:43,970
wreckage and took it with them so we

838
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:45,740
don't know how many of this how much of

839
00:42:50,890 --> 00:42:47,450
this material may be out there in

840
00:42:52,810 --> 00:42:50,900
people's attics stored away in that

841
00:42:57,550 --> 00:42:52,820
whole area from all the people who came

842
00:43:00,970 --> 00:42:57,560
out and collected pieces so and then

843
00:43:07,900 --> 00:43:00,980
finally the newspaper accounts closed by

844
00:43:12,930 --> 00:43:07,910
saying that the townspeople wanted to

845
00:43:17,020 --> 00:43:12,940
give the being a proper Christian burial

846
00:43:20,290 --> 00:43:17,030
and so they gathered up the body and

847
00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:20,300
they buried it in the loop in the town

848
00:43:26,680 --> 00:43:24,130
cemetery would still exist today

849
00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:26,690
although unfortunately the exact

850
00:43:32,620 --> 00:43:30,650
location of the grave is not known it's

851
00:43:35,710 --> 00:43:32,630
been lost over the years there was a

852
00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:35,720
headstone with some witnesses have

853
00:43:42,190 --> 00:43:39,130
stated included a picture of a

854
00:43:44,710 --> 00:43:42,200
disc-shaped object which was a

855
00:43:48,070 --> 00:43:44,720
representation of the object before it

856
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:48,080
crashed but the headstone disappear

857
00:43:53,770 --> 00:43:50,450
third and nobody knows the exact

858
00:43:57,030 --> 00:43:53,780
location of the grave it's thought to be

859
00:44:02,200 --> 00:43:57,040
there still in the Aurora town cemetery

860
00:44:04,660 --> 00:44:02,210
well now the one thing that that puzzled

861
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:04,670
me when you said it was that there was a

862
00:44:09,730 --> 00:44:06,890
witness that mentioned that the debris

863
00:44:12,790 --> 00:44:09,740
looked a lot like macross between silver

864
00:44:17,200 --> 00:44:12,800
and aluminum but at that time wasn't

865
00:44:18,730 --> 00:44:17,210
aluminum a very rare substance like no

866
00:44:20,710 --> 00:44:18,740
one would ever say that they're a quote

867
00:44:23,740 --> 00:44:20,720
from the article and the dallas morning

868
00:44:28,300 --> 00:44:23,750
news from april nineteen eighty ninety

869
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:28,310
seven what it actually says is the ship

870
00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:30,650
was too badly wrecked to form any

871
00:44:36,490 --> 00:44:32,930
conclusion as to its construction or

872
00:44:39,100 --> 00:44:36,500
motive power it was built of an unknown

873
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:39,110
metal resembling saw what a mixture of

874
00:44:44,860 --> 00:44:41,930
aluminum and silver well and it must

875
00:44:46,750 --> 00:44:44,870
have weighed several tons I thought all

876
00:44:48,820 --> 00:44:46,760
of that description all of that detail

877
00:44:51,180 --> 00:44:48,830
in that description is pretty

878
00:44:54,670 --> 00:44:51,190
interesting for this time period

879
00:44:57,550 --> 00:44:54,680
absolutely so I before we go on in this

880
00:45:00,970 --> 00:44:57,560
case I wanted to officially welcome

881
00:45:05,740 --> 00:45:00,980
Ruben to the show how are you Ruben good

882
00:45:08,530 --> 00:45:05,750
there there I it was hope you could hear

883
00:45:11,080 --> 00:45:08,540
me pretty well I yeah I always find the

884
00:45:13,450 --> 00:45:11,090
Aurora crash very interesting with no

885
00:45:16,950 --> 00:45:13,460
he's covering in fact yesterday I came

886
00:45:20,470 --> 00:45:16,960
across some paper newspaper clippings of

887
00:45:22,870 --> 00:45:20,480
the Aurora crash and I was just glancing

888
00:45:26,380 --> 00:45:22,880
through them and there was a newspaper

889
00:45:27,850 --> 00:45:26,390
article leave back in 1979 where they

890
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:27,860
interviewed several people and they

891
00:45:32,350 --> 00:45:30,170
actually had supposedly piece of the

892
00:45:35,950 --> 00:45:32,360
metal that smaller piece of metal that

893
00:45:38,620 --> 00:45:35,960
they had that they had analyzed as well

894
00:45:40,570 --> 00:45:38,630
as witnesses there was a 92 year old

895
00:45:43,870 --> 00:45:40,580
woman that were remembered when she was

896
00:45:45,640 --> 00:45:43,880
a young kid all the interesting

897
00:45:48,400 --> 00:45:45,650
developments I was going on in her town

898
00:45:50,290 --> 00:45:48,410
and how they were going about to bury so

899
00:45:52,750 --> 00:45:50,300
they mean those were it's really

900
00:45:54,490 --> 00:45:52,760
interesting to have having her point of

901
00:45:58,120 --> 00:45:54,500
view in that newspaper article i mean i

902
00:45:59,740 --> 00:45:58,130
think uh no II I may have sent that to

903
00:46:01,780 --> 00:45:59,750
you a while back but if not i'll

904
00:46:05,190 --> 00:46:01,790
definitely try to forward to you find

905
00:46:07,930 --> 00:46:05,200
and it's there are some interesting

906
00:46:10,870 --> 00:46:07,940
information in those newspaper clippings

907
00:46:15,100 --> 00:46:10,880
but absolutely it's one of them one of

908
00:46:17,290 --> 00:46:15,110
those jams that of history and also

909
00:46:20,080 --> 00:46:17,300
during that period of time there was

910
00:46:21,700 --> 00:46:20,090
there was a great airship sightings so

911
00:46:23,140 --> 00:46:21,710
this happened right around during that

912
00:46:25,900 --> 00:46:23,150
period from throughout here in

913
00:46:28,090 --> 00:46:25,910
California and in other parts of the

914
00:46:30,280 --> 00:46:28,100
Southwest and including Mexico they were

915
00:46:31,900 --> 00:46:30,290
also having your sightings of these

916
00:46:34,510 --> 00:46:31,910
airships so it's interesting how the

917
00:46:36,460 --> 00:46:34,520
Aurora crash ties right into this now

918
00:46:38,290 --> 00:46:36,470
we're where would one find these

919
00:46:41,350 --> 00:46:38,300
newspaper clippings is just something

920
00:46:45,220 --> 00:46:41,360
you did through like the old microfiche

921
00:46:47,980 --> 00:46:45,230
way or is this some some way you found

922
00:46:51,220 --> 00:46:47,990
this online oh no actually these are

923
00:46:57,160 --> 00:46:51,230
actual paper clippings I I was very

924
00:46:59,560 --> 00:46:57,170
fortunate to have acquired files thought

925
00:47:02,200 --> 00:46:59,570
from several investigators that have

926
00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:02,210
passed away and researchers and they've

927
00:47:08,470 --> 00:47:05,330
donated and gave me their books as well

928
00:47:10,330 --> 00:47:08,480
some of the research material and way

929
00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:10,340
back move on did have a clipping service

930
00:47:15,940 --> 00:47:12,770
where people would go through all the

931
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:15,950
newspapers and and find any articles

932
00:47:21,700 --> 00:47:18,410
related to UFOs and that's what I find

933
00:47:23,110 --> 00:47:21,710
most fascinating in fact no he may have

934
00:47:25,540 --> 00:47:23,120
mentioned that if he hasn't yet the

935
00:47:28,120 --> 00:47:25,550
Cowboys and Aliens book that was all

936
00:47:31,140 --> 00:47:28,130
based on newspaper articles from back

937
00:47:33,850 --> 00:47:31,150
then in the 1880s or during the 1800s of

938
00:47:36,100 --> 00:47:33,860
accounts written and of course you know

939
00:47:38,170 --> 00:47:36,110
back then we didn't have anything that

940
00:47:40,170 --> 00:47:38,180
was flying during that period of time we

941
00:47:42,820 --> 00:47:40,180
didn't have airplanes you know so

942
00:47:46,180 --> 00:47:42,830
whatever account that were housed it

943
00:47:48,370 --> 00:47:46,190
relates to Aurora obviously you know

944
00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:48,380
wasn't no people nowadays can't say well

945
00:47:51,940 --> 00:47:49,850
was a balloon it was this or that

946
00:47:53,850 --> 00:47:51,950
because quite frankly we didn't have

947
00:47:58,960 --> 00:47:53,860
that much happening up in the air until

948
00:48:00,430 --> 00:47:58,970
as technology improved so the newspaper

949
00:48:02,110 --> 00:48:00,440
going back to the newspaper clippings

950
00:48:05,290 --> 00:48:02,120
all it's amazing some of the stuff that

951
00:48:07,780 --> 00:48:05,300
i find it goes back to the 60s 50s and

952
00:48:09,700 --> 00:48:07,790
gives you a very good idea what was

953
00:48:12,720 --> 00:48:09,710
going on back in with the politics of

954
00:48:14,980 --> 00:48:12,730
UFOs and how it relates to do today

955
00:48:16,900 --> 00:48:14,990
right now

956
00:48:21,160 --> 00:48:16,910
this i would i would say that this is

957
00:48:23,730 --> 00:48:21,170
probably the unit of the earliest UFO

958
00:48:27,160 --> 00:48:23,740
well definitely the earliest UFO crash

959
00:48:29,710 --> 00:48:27,170
then they were you know the sightings i

960
00:48:32,710 --> 00:48:29,720
don't think that you're going to find

961
00:48:37,020 --> 00:48:32,720
too much out there that is documented

962
00:48:40,180 --> 00:48:37,030
like in newspapers that's uh that's this

963
00:48:42,250 --> 00:48:40,190
literally well actually there are other

964
00:48:48,280 --> 00:48:42,260
accounts in the book cowboys and aliens

965
00:48:50,080 --> 00:48:48,290
of other UFO crashes that people had to

966
00:48:53,380 --> 00:48:50,090
come into had encounter i think one of

967
00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:53,390
the earliest was back in 1854 i can't

968
00:48:58,720 --> 00:48:55,490
can't remember quite if thats exactly

969
00:49:01,510 --> 00:48:58,730
Joey yeah let's backtrack and tell him

970
00:49:04,030 --> 00:49:01,520
about our book we don't want to get

971
00:49:08,650 --> 00:49:04,040
anybody confused with the fictional

972
00:49:12,190 --> 00:49:08,660
movie by spielberg our our book Rubin

973
00:49:14,470 --> 00:49:12,200
and I did a book and along with what was

974
00:49:16,450 --> 00:49:14,480
actually written by myself and John

975
00:49:20,260 --> 00:49:16,460
LeMay Andrew and Reuben help with the

976
00:49:24,040 --> 00:49:20,270
research we did a book calls the real

977
00:49:28,420 --> 00:49:24,050
cowboys and aliens we published it in

978
00:49:31,050 --> 00:49:28,430
2012 and it was subtitled UFO encounters

979
00:49:34,120 --> 00:49:31,060
of the Old West and what it was was

980
00:49:36,370 --> 00:49:34,130
around the time that Spielberg movie

981
00:49:39,640 --> 00:49:36,380
Cowboys and Aliens which was total

982
00:49:41,530 --> 00:49:39,650
fiction lots of explosions lots of

983
00:49:43,660 --> 00:49:41,540
really weird aliens trying to steal

984
00:49:45,910 --> 00:49:43,670
earth's resources those of us who

985
00:49:49,510 --> 00:49:45,920
thought it was a delightful entertaining

986
00:49:52,000 --> 00:49:49,520
picture on many levels but certainly was

987
00:49:54,940 --> 00:49:52,010
not in any way an accurate

988
00:49:57,310 --> 00:49:54,950
representation of the very real UFO

989
00:50:00,420 --> 00:49:57,320
encounters that occurred in the 1800s in

990
00:50:03,430 --> 00:50:00,430
North America so around the time that

991
00:50:06,040 --> 00:50:03,440
Spielberg movie was about to come out we

992
00:50:09,480 --> 00:50:06,050
were asked the question by cyril people

993
00:50:12,700 --> 00:50:09,490
were there really encounters between

994
00:50:16,510 --> 00:50:12,710
people living in the Old West in North

995
00:50:22,210 --> 00:50:16,520
America and UFOs and UFO occupants and

996
00:50:27,370 --> 00:50:22,220
the answer was a resounding yes because

997
00:50:28,690 --> 00:50:27,380
we found many many accounts in in the

998
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:28,700
documents of the time

999
00:50:35,040 --> 00:50:32,050
and the newspapers and other periodicals

1000
00:50:37,920 --> 00:50:35,050
giving detailed descriptions from

1001
00:50:39,870 --> 00:50:37,930
seemingly highly credible witnesses

1002
00:50:44,380 --> 00:50:39,880
including including law enforcement

1003
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:44,390
agents and other very restricted

1004
00:50:54,400 --> 00:50:48,530
townspeople of that era who claimed to

1005
00:50:58,500 --> 00:50:54,410
have seen UFOs flying around and also

1006
00:51:02,050 --> 00:50:58,510
have seen beings who were standing near

1007
00:51:05,260 --> 00:51:02,060
objects that had landed so it's a

1008
00:51:07,690 --> 00:51:05,270
fascinating study and Reuben and I came

1009
00:51:10,060 --> 00:51:07,700
out with this book allah jalla may and

1010
00:51:13,839 --> 00:51:10,070
reuben helped called the real cowboys

1011
00:51:19,020 --> 00:51:13,849
and aliens and what we had a chapter in

1012
00:51:21,339 --> 00:51:19,030
that book about the Aurora UFO crash in

1013
00:51:24,520 --> 00:51:21,349
1897 that we've been talking about on

1014
00:51:26,950 --> 00:51:24,530
the program tonight and it is one of the

1015
00:51:29,170 --> 00:51:26,960
more popular talks wouldn't you say

1016
00:51:31,450 --> 00:51:29,180
Ruben whenever we speak about our book

1017
00:51:33,670 --> 00:51:31,460
the real cowboys and aliens sleep we

1018
00:51:36,309 --> 00:51:33,680
really get really good response from the

1019
00:51:40,420 --> 00:51:36,319
audiences people love hearing about

1020
00:51:44,020 --> 00:51:40,430
these old UFO cases from long before

1021
00:51:49,690 --> 00:51:44,030
there were any objects in the sky flying

1022
00:51:52,210 --> 00:51:49,700
around man-made objects so 1864 is the

1023
00:51:56,530 --> 00:51:52,220
first chapter in the book it's about the

1024
00:52:01,210 --> 00:51:56,540
crash of a strange object in the rocky

1025
00:52:05,349 --> 00:52:01,220
mountain it's called Rocky Mountain UFO

1026
00:52:08,650 --> 00:52:05,359
explosion and so that actually happened

1027
00:52:11,920 --> 00:52:08,660
that was that is the first documented

1028
00:52:15,250 --> 00:52:11,930
case that we could find for our books

1029
00:52:19,569 --> 00:52:15,260
how they reported UFO crash so that was

1030
00:52:23,800 --> 00:52:19,579
even earlier than the 1897 date of the

1031
00:52:28,120 --> 00:52:23,810
Aurora interestingly enough all right

1032
00:52:32,589 --> 00:52:28,130
Wow so just a couple of things what

1033
00:52:36,579 --> 00:52:32,599
about I've heard that or read somewhere

1034
00:52:39,760 --> 00:52:36,589
that the reporter Hayden or whatever his

1035
00:52:41,589 --> 00:52:39,770
name was that wrote that yeah I heard

1036
00:52:42,370 --> 00:52:41,599
that he claimed later that he made the

1037
00:52:46,560 --> 00:52:42,380
whole thing

1038
00:52:51,180 --> 00:52:46,570
um have you looked into that yes i have

1039
00:52:54,490 --> 00:52:51,190
i have heard that claim but it was a

1040
00:52:58,180 --> 00:52:54,500
secondhand claim i have never found any

1041
00:53:02,040 --> 00:52:58,190
documents or direct evidence of him

1042
00:53:05,530 --> 00:53:02,050
saying those words rather there was a

1043
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:05,540
lady whose name escapes me now who

1044
00:53:15,040 --> 00:53:09,490
claims she overheard him saying that and

1045
00:53:18,820 --> 00:53:15,050
another another critical view viewpoint

1046
00:53:23,500 --> 00:53:18,830
on the Aurora incident is that because

1047
00:53:25,510 --> 00:53:23,510
the town was in dire economic shape some

1048
00:53:29,530 --> 00:53:25,520
of the businesses and industries in the

1049
00:53:32,800 --> 00:53:29,540
town had closed and the town was in

1050
00:53:35,490 --> 00:53:32,810
danger of basically drying up and

1051
00:53:39,210 --> 00:53:35,500
blowing away that because of all that

1052
00:53:44,350 --> 00:53:39,220
this story was made up in order to bring

1053
00:53:47,970 --> 00:53:44,360
visitors and tourism to the area this is

1054
00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:47,980
19 if this is 1897 or talking about and

1055
00:53:57,280 --> 00:53:53,210
you know that that once again is one

1056
00:53:59,800 --> 00:53:57,290
person's conjecture that you know she in

1057
00:54:02,770 --> 00:53:59,810
her mind is convinced that because the

1058
00:54:05,980 --> 00:54:02,780
town had some economic hardship then

1059
00:54:09,610 --> 00:54:05,990
this story must have been a way to

1060
00:54:12,790 --> 00:54:09,620
attempt to revitalize town and that was

1061
00:54:16,240 --> 00:54:12,800
her opinion on why this story suddenly

1062
00:54:17,950 --> 00:54:16,250
appeared in in the end of her but I have

1063
00:54:19,720 --> 00:54:17,960
never seen a direct evidence that

1064
00:54:22,230 --> 00:54:19,730
indicates that that was the actual

1065
00:54:24,730 --> 00:54:22,240
reason that was just her her take on it

1066
00:54:31,630 --> 00:54:24,740
okay now Reuben I'm going to ask you

1067
00:54:33,820 --> 00:54:31,640
this what has there been any I'll anyone

1068
00:54:36,490 --> 00:54:33,830
looking into trying to exhume the body

1069
00:54:40,990 --> 00:54:36,500
to examine to see if they can find the

1070
00:54:43,540 --> 00:54:41,000
body first of all oh I think I'm going

1071
00:54:45,250 --> 00:54:43,550
to try to look for my my clippings just

1072
00:54:48,220 --> 00:54:45,260
in case everyone to share some of the

1073
00:54:51,760 --> 00:54:48,230
information but I there has been

1074
00:54:54,070 --> 00:54:51,770
attempts and they were trying to exhume

1075
00:54:56,320 --> 00:54:54,080
the body and I know I believe they went

1076
00:55:00,580 --> 00:54:56,330
to develop a land

1077
00:55:04,450 --> 00:55:00,590
mark right dedicating the actual UFO

1078
00:55:06,670 --> 00:55:04,460
crash as a landmark here in the city as

1079
00:55:09,340 --> 00:55:06,680
well as absolutely correct it's one of

1080
00:55:13,570 --> 00:55:09,350
the few state historical markers that

1081
00:55:16,920 --> 00:55:13,580
exists in the united states that

1082
00:55:21,010 --> 00:55:16,930
actually commemorates a UFO event

1083
00:55:24,400 --> 00:55:21,020
because if you go to the aurora town

1084
00:55:27,970 --> 00:55:24,410
cemetery which by the way the city is

1085
00:55:30,700 --> 00:55:27,980
going to be offering shuttle tours of

1086
00:55:34,690 --> 00:55:30,710
both the cemetery and the crash site

1087
00:55:37,090 --> 00:55:34,700
where this happened in 1897 they're

1088
00:55:39,160 --> 00:55:37,100
going to be offering actual tours of

1089
00:55:42,460 --> 00:55:39,170
those two locations on Saturday April

1090
00:55:43,930 --> 00:55:42,470
sixteenth as part of the this event

1091
00:55:48,550 --> 00:55:43,940
we've been talking about called the

1092
00:55:50,890 --> 00:55:48,560
Aurora alien encounter and these folks

1093
00:55:53,140 --> 00:55:50,900
are really serious about commemorating

1094
00:55:57,240 --> 00:55:53,150
this is an actual historical event there

1095
00:56:02,170 --> 00:55:57,250
was a city proclamation that was passed

1096
00:56:06,370 --> 00:56:02,180
by the town of Aurora and the City

1097
00:56:08,230 --> 00:56:06,380
Administrator there is is a person that

1098
00:56:11,740 --> 00:56:08,240
I'm really really looking forward to

1099
00:56:17,980 --> 00:56:11,750
spending some time talking to dr. Tony

1100
00:56:21,490 --> 00:56:17,990
wheeler her grandfather was born in

1101
00:56:26,380 --> 00:56:21,500
Aurora shortly after the Aurora incident

1102
00:56:28,450 --> 00:56:26,390
and he knew a lot of the old-timers who

1103
00:56:31,510 --> 00:56:28,460
lived at the time of the Aurora crash

1104
00:56:36,130 --> 00:56:31,520
and dr. wheeler who is now the city

1105
00:56:38,350 --> 00:56:36,140
administrator in in Aurora is one of the

1106
00:56:40,810 --> 00:56:38,360
big movers and shakers of this

1107
00:56:45,790 --> 00:56:40,820
commemorative event that's happening in

1108
00:56:48,730 --> 00:56:45,800
two weeks and she is going to as she

1109
00:56:51,100 --> 00:56:48,740
guides people to the two sides the

1110
00:56:56,710 --> 00:56:51,110
actual crash site of the object and the

1111
00:56:59,710 --> 00:56:56,720
site worthy with a the D cemetery where

1112
00:57:01,600 --> 00:56:59,720
the body was later buried as she takes

1113
00:57:03,910 --> 00:57:01,610
people through their she's going to kind

1114
00:57:07,210 --> 00:57:03,920
of narrate and tell the stories that she

1115
00:57:09,130 --> 00:57:07,220
heard you know through her family

1116
00:57:09,720 --> 00:57:09,140
through her grandfather about the

1117
00:57:12,330 --> 00:57:09,730
incident

1118
00:57:15,840 --> 00:57:12,340
so this is another unique insiders

1119
00:57:18,000 --> 00:57:15,850
perspective and as I said because of her

1120
00:57:21,840 --> 00:57:18,010
family history and her familiarity with

1121
00:57:24,390 --> 00:57:21,850
the area and whiskey story she is the

1122
00:57:28,020 --> 00:57:24,400
perfect candidate to to guide these

1123
00:57:31,170 --> 00:57:28,030
doors right no he's art go ahead i

1124
00:57:37,080 --> 00:57:31,180
recall that uh weren't they also keeping

1125
00:57:39,210 --> 00:57:37,090
the actual location up secret as far as

1126
00:57:41,160 --> 00:57:39,220
the actual where the body was I'm trying

1127
00:57:44,460 --> 00:57:41,170
to recall that how that played into that

1128
00:57:47,609 --> 00:57:44,470
no what happened was and be the grave

1129
00:57:53,340 --> 00:57:47,619
marker that was in place was stolen or

1130
00:57:59,900 --> 00:57:53,350
removed at some point we think in the

1131
00:58:02,609 --> 00:57:59,910
late 60s early 70s and they basically

1132
00:58:08,040 --> 00:58:02,619
nobody kept track of where the actual

1133
00:58:10,920 --> 00:58:08,050
grave was and so there is a there is an

1134
00:58:15,599 --> 00:58:10,930
ordinance or a regulation there that

1135
00:58:19,710 --> 00:58:15,609
prevents any hit one from exhuming any

1136
00:58:23,370 --> 00:58:19,720
of the of the remains they're so past

1137
00:58:25,470 --> 00:58:23,380
attempts I would assume unless it's law

1138
00:58:29,490 --> 00:58:25,480
enforcement related life in an

1139
00:58:33,090 --> 00:58:29,500
investigation for involving a crime they

1140
00:58:36,030 --> 00:58:33,100
don't allow somebody to dig dig dig up

1141
00:58:39,210 --> 00:58:36,040
remain there so basically several groups

1142
00:58:41,099 --> 00:58:39,220
have tried to obtain permission and have

1143
00:58:44,220 --> 00:58:41,109
been denied it and it's still standing

1144
00:58:46,290 --> 00:58:44,230
policy so there have been attempts to

1145
00:58:48,570 --> 00:58:46,300
use ground-penetrating radar and other

1146
00:58:51,349 --> 00:58:48,580
technologies but the results have been

1147
00:58:54,359 --> 00:58:51,359
inconclusive the UFO hunters had a an

1148
00:59:00,060 --> 00:58:54,369
episode where ground-penetrating radar

1149
00:59:01,530 --> 00:59:00,070
found some interesting underground it's

1150
00:59:03,660 --> 00:59:01,540
kind of like a the works or like an

1151
00:59:09,000 --> 00:59:03,670
ultrasound and there was an interesting

1152
00:59:11,190 --> 00:59:09,010
underground object that you know there

1153
00:59:14,910 --> 00:59:11,200
there was obviously a mass there and it

1154
00:59:17,970 --> 00:59:14,920
could be seeking using the equipment but

1155
00:59:21,359 --> 00:59:17,980
it was indefinite as to whether that was

1156
00:59:23,549 --> 00:59:21,369
the actual body of the Buried spaceman

1157
00:59:26,740 --> 00:59:23,559
or not well

1158
00:59:29,190 --> 00:59:26,750
no II just if you would try to watch

1159
00:59:31,930 --> 00:59:29,200
your phone dial pad if you would please

1160
00:59:33,190 --> 00:59:31,940
so very well thank you yeah we're at the

1161
00:59:37,420 --> 00:59:33,200
top of the hour we're going to be

1162
00:59:40,089 --> 00:59:37,430
talking about actually the cisco grove

1163
00:59:41,230 --> 00:59:40,099
incident and part of the second hour and

1164
00:59:46,839 --> 00:59:41,240
we're going to continue on this

1165
00:59:52,140 --> 00:59:46,849
conversation but so Reuben back to you

1166
00:59:54,759 --> 00:59:52,150
is is this case just one of those total

1167
00:59:56,829 --> 00:59:54,769
baffling ones that you know we're

1168
01:00:00,579 --> 00:59:56,839
probably at this point being you know

1169
01:00:02,559 --> 01:00:00,589
100 plus years old we'll never find any

1170
01:00:05,740 --> 01:00:02,569
new evidence or do you think thinks

1171
01:00:11,230 --> 01:00:05,750
something will change in as far as what

1172
01:00:15,039 --> 01:00:11,240
the cemetery management is involved that

1173
01:00:16,269 --> 01:00:15,049
eventually they'll let their being I was

1174
01:00:20,200 --> 01:00:16,279
going to mention ground-penetrating

1175
01:00:23,049 --> 01:00:20,210
radar and obviously they may know where

1176
01:00:25,150 --> 01:00:23,059
it is do you think any of the thing will

1177
01:00:27,759 --> 01:00:25,160
change and this can be actually figured

1178
01:00:29,589 --> 01:00:27,769
out because if there was indeed

1179
01:00:31,779 --> 01:00:29,599
something from not this earth buried

1180
01:00:36,220 --> 01:00:31,789
under there then you'd have an answer to

1181
01:00:38,140 --> 01:00:36,230
a lot of questions oh absolutely i mean

1182
01:00:40,870 --> 01:00:38,150
one of the things that both noe and i

1183
01:00:44,440 --> 01:00:40,880
really enjoy is going through these

1184
01:00:47,019 --> 01:00:44,450
historical documents and a particular

1185
01:00:49,809 --> 01:00:47,029
case it's really never settled because

1186
01:00:52,059 --> 01:00:49,819
there always seems to be one way or

1187
01:00:54,099 --> 01:00:52,069
another more additional evidence that

1188
01:00:57,069 --> 01:00:54,109
will show up it'll be quite interesting

1189
01:01:00,190 --> 01:00:57,079
to see at this conference what some of

1190
01:01:04,630 --> 01:01:00,200
the additional latest information that

1191
01:01:08,289 --> 01:01:04,640
might be coming out and so it it is one

1192
01:01:12,339 --> 01:01:08,299
of several important cases here in

1193
01:01:13,920 --> 01:01:12,349
ufology and i think over over the long

1194
01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:13,930
run who knows there might be a

1195
01:01:19,870 --> 01:01:17,930
connection just like what we did we

1196
01:01:25,799 --> 01:01:19,880
found a connection between UFO crash

1197
01:01:30,160 --> 01:01:25,809
retrievals and we found the some of the

1198
01:01:33,160 --> 01:01:30,170
interesting procedures and operations at

1199
01:01:35,710 --> 01:01:33,170
the air force was involved in and all

1200
01:01:37,029 --> 01:01:35,720
those different players that have played

1201
01:01:39,939 --> 01:01:37,039
an important part in the

1202
01:01:42,900 --> 01:01:39,949
retrieval so absolutely I think we'll

1203
01:01:44,949 --> 01:01:42,910
always seem to learn something new and

1204
01:01:47,380 --> 01:01:44,959
and it's something that should never be

1205
01:01:48,969 --> 01:01:47,390
forgotten because it was something very

1206
01:01:51,789 --> 01:01:48,979
significant that happened in that

1207
01:01:54,549 --> 01:01:51,799
particular area in that city and people

1208
01:01:56,979 --> 01:01:54,559
need to take a look at that that's one

1209
01:02:00,130 --> 01:01:56,989
of the reason why we're seeing a an

1210
01:02:04,569 --> 01:02:00,140
interest by cities in there and that are

1211
01:02:07,659 --> 01:02:04,579
interested in mobilizing people and in

1212
01:02:11,109 --> 01:02:07,669
terms of their history they come

1213
01:02:15,269 --> 01:02:11,119
chambers of comrades for example Roswell

1214
01:02:17,829 --> 01:02:15,279
New Mexico they've turned the 1947

1215
01:02:20,349 --> 01:02:17,839
incident to a very large event where

1216
01:02:22,239 --> 01:02:20,359
thousands of people come worst we

1217
01:02:24,849 --> 01:02:22,249
thought with some of the goals that both

1218
01:02:28,299 --> 01:02:24,859
know and I have a tad with using the

1219
01:02:30,489 --> 01:02:28,309
border zone conferences of educating

1220
01:02:32,919 --> 01:02:30,499
people about what was going on and it's

1221
01:02:34,989 --> 01:02:32,929
catching on and there's other towns that

1222
01:02:37,809 --> 01:02:34,999
have been doing that as well where they

1223
01:02:40,959 --> 01:02:37,819
will focus on a particular paranormal

1224
01:02:43,380 --> 01:02:40,969
event and get a lot of tourists visited

1225
01:02:45,880 --> 01:02:43,390
it just all of a sudden it will bring

1226
01:02:48,699 --> 01:02:45,890
probability new people involved in who

1227
01:02:50,109 --> 01:02:48,709
knows what what other sources well

1228
01:02:51,909 --> 01:02:50,119
that's it for the first part of the show

1229
01:02:54,699 --> 01:02:51,919
we thank you for listening if you'd like

1230
01:02:56,739 --> 01:02:54,709
to listen to the whole show plus all the

1231
01:02:59,259 --> 01:02:56,749
archives all you have to do is become a

1232
01:03:01,689 --> 01:02:59,269
member for only two dollars or more per

1233
01:03:05,620 --> 01:03:01,699
month all that information is on our top

1234
01:03:08,769 --> 01:03:05,630
menu bar on podcast UFO calm thanks for

1235
01:03:11,499 --> 01:03:08,779
listening also don't forget if you feel

1236
01:03:15,009 --> 01:03:11,509
like helping me out sponsoring me for

1237
01:03:18,729 --> 01:03:15,019
getting my head completely buzzed bald

1238
01:03:21,519 --> 01:03:18,739
next week one week from tonight go to

1239
01:03:23,919 --> 01:03:21,529
the same website podcast UFO calm and

1240
01:03:27,130 --> 01:03:23,929
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1241
01:03:30,309 --> 01:03:27,140
banner the money goes to children with

1242
01:03:32,349 --> 01:03:30,319
cancer and their families so anyway

1243
01:03:35,109 --> 01:03:32,359
thank you all and we'll be seeing you

1244
01:03:36,999 --> 01:03:35,119
here next week I want to thank Kerry

1245
01:03:39,399 --> 01:03:37,009
Lloyd White House for the music our

1246
01:03:40,870 --> 01:03:39,409
guests of course and other people that

1247
01:03:42,519 --> 01:03:40,880
helped out with the show thank you all

1248
01:03:44,770 --> 01:03:42,529
talk to you next week and remember to